Tanned, rested, and ready, Norman Angell lives again—and he now wears US Navy khaki. He’s doubled down on his thesis that economic interdependence ought to end war, insisting that globalization has ended war between leading powers like China and the United States. Writing in the US Naval Institute Proceedings, Lt. Cmdr. Matthew Harper maintains that those of us who take China’s naval rise seriously gaze ‘through a spyglass, distortedly,’ omitting a ‘glaring detail’ about this momentous development—namely ‘the global economy.’
In particular, he writes, calling attention to Chinese weaponry like the DF-21D/CSS-5 anti-ship ballistic missile is ‘both overblown and unproductive for the United States and its military.’ Harper alleges that I and my co-author Toshi Yoshihara are among those pushing a skewed understanding of Chinese military power:
‘In Red Star over the Pacific…Naval War College professors Toshi Yoshihara and James Holmes examine the rise of the Chinese military. However, they also appear to dismiss the wider ramifications of a Sino-American conflict. In describing the Chinese advantages of firing anti-ship missiles deep from inland China, the authors write, “the United States would risk a limited naval conflict escalating into a full-blown war against China, its leading trading partner.” While they note that China is America’s largest trading partner, they still imply a limited naval conflict over Taiwan is possible.’
We imply nothing. We say explicitly, in Red Star over the Pacific and many other forums, that such a conflict is possible. US-China economic ties elevate the costs of armed conflict for both belligerents, but can’t rule it out entirely. Other interests supersede economics at times. Conducting strikes on the Chinese mainland could carry vast economic and political consequences for the United States. Knowing this—and knowing that Washington knows it—Beijing can hope to deter the United States from coming to the island’s defence. Should a conflict come to pass, Chinese leaders hope Washington will stand aside for the sake of national self-interest.
Harper thus maintains categorically that even a limited naval conflict is impossible. Never say never. Among the foreign policy pundits the good commander tries to enlist in his cause is New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman. The United States and China, writes Harper, inhabit Friedman’s ‘flat world’ of ‘increasing interconnectedness,’ where war among major trading partners is apparently unthinkable. The trouble is that Friedman actually doesn’t say this. Quite the opposite. He rolled out The World Is Flat, the self-same book Harper invokes, during a 2005 interview with Charlie Rose. During the interview, Friedman observes that globalization boosts the costs of geopolitical competition—including war—but can’t end it altogether. ‘I have no illusions,’ he says, ‘that the Dell theory or anything else will stop China from invading Taiwan if Taiwan declares independence tomorrow.’ Which sounds rather like, well, us. Interdependence discourages but can’t prevent war. If Prof. Yoshihara and I undersell the economic factor in international relations, we’re in good company alongside the bestselling Friedman.
But I digress. Norman Angell was an English intellectual who published a book titled The Great Illusion in the years immediately preceding the First World War. (As it happens, the third edition appeared precisely a century ago.) The fin de siècle world was even more economically interdependent than ours by many indices. By Harper’s logic, then, the Great War—a war among nations connected through trade and finance—should never have transpired. Angell was more realistic. Historians often claim that Angell predicted an end to war owing to the advance of globalization. Not so; he proclaimed that globalization should put an end to war, but for the false consciousness gripping the minds of world leaders and their constituents. That is, he believed that statesmen who truly comprehended and embraced the logic of economic interdependence would transcend military conflict.
Angell didn’t delude himself that his views on war and peace already held sway. He castigated the European imperial powers for flouting his argument that warfare was economically self-defeating. The great powers clung obstinately to the ‘great illusion’ that they could improve their national well-being by resorting to arms. He bewailed the fact that not ‘a single authority of note’ had gainsaid the axiom that force advanced national interests. Pacifists were ‘at one with the veriest fire-eaters on this point.’ The great powers, then, could never escape the cycle of power politics and war until they shed their most basic assumptions about international politics. In this he was prophetic. The outbreak of world war in 1914 speedily dispelled any fantasies about the irresistible pacifying effects of globalization. The great illusion—if illusion it is—endured in the minds of statesmen and ordinary citizens.
So Angell, unlike Harper, refused to succumb to wishful thinking. Likewise historians and practitioners from Thucydides to Sun Tzu to Clausewitz. Thucydides maintained that fear, honour, and interest drive states’ actions in the international arena. Sun Tzu saw a cutthroat world of warring kingdoms in which ambition, guile, and deceit were at a premium. Clausewitz accentuated the influence of dark passions like hate, anger, and fear on the resort to and conduct of warfare. It’s hard to assign numbers to intangibles like fear and honour, factoring them into cost/benefit calculations. Clausewitz places great weight on the rational calculus of war, but he insists that strategy and war can’t be reduced to simple algorithms.
Nevertheless, let’s suppose the United States acts on Harper’s recommendations, ceasing to pay the Chinese military build-up much heed. If in fact cost/benefit analysis renders war moot, then Washington can afford to leave Asia. It can shutter its bases and drastically cut back its own armed forces. Why go to needless expense and trouble in a self-regulating Angellian world? But we soon encounter contradictions. At the same time Harper implores US policymakers to lay down the sword, he urges US diplomats to ‘manage’ China’s rise. Why? If force is no longer the coin of the international realm, Washington should let the region to sort out its own future. An interconnected Asia will resolve its differences without armed strife. But if a US presence is necessary to guard against some miscalculation that embroils the region in crisis or conflict, then clearly economics is not all-important. An Angellian order of perpetual peace still eludes us.
And how should Washington manage China’s rise? Having set down the military implement, how could US leaders hope to shape anything? They could negotiate with China from a position of weakness, having renounced Theodore Roosevelt’s ‘Big Stick.’ Or they could wage economic warfare in hopes of deterring or reversing Chinese misbehaviour. But history has been unkind to economic sanctions and inducements as a stand-alone instrument to persuade others to foreswear vital interests. Look no further than the sanctions on Saddam Hussein’s Iraq during the 1990s, or the long-running nuclear standoffs with the Islamic Republic of Iran and China’s client North Korea. There’s little reason to expect Beijing to display less resolve than Baghdad, Tehran, or Pyongyang when national unity, geostrategic interests, and other critical goods are at stake. For something all-powerful, economics alone is an unreliable instrument of statecraft.
It would be pleasant to dwell in a world where decisions to fight for national interests derive purely from cost/benefit analysis and economics has repealed the logic of power politics. Sadly, Angell’s ideal world is not the world we inhabit. Beijing has forcefully, repeatedly, and apparently sincerely declared that it will use force to obtain or defend ‘core interests’ like Taiwan, Tibet, and—arguably—the South China Sea. In some cases, for instance the 2005 Anti-Secession Law vis-à-vis Taiwan, political leaders have transcribed this austere worldview into law. There’s little reason, then, to think Chinese leaders have discarded Angell’s great illusion. They tell us they believe military power remains a useful tool of a geopolitically minded foreign policy. China’s grand strategy and military build-up match the leadership’s words. The most prudent course is to take Beijing at its word—not wish away unpleasant realities.
James Holmes is an associate professor of strategy at the US Naval War College and co-author of ‘China and the Commons: Angell or Mahan?’ (World Affairs, 2006). The views voiced here are his alone.

Emmett Conrecode
This is nonsense.
After two proxi-wars whith China, Korea and Vietnam, Nixon opened up the US markets to a slave labor economy. We are loosing the battle on the factory floors instead of fields of war. The wealth is being transferred just as effectively as if we lost the cold war. Time to recognize this is an economic war instead a shooting war. It's time to charge tariffs that reflect the true cost of production in China.
Youngstown Ohio economic refugee following the steel-mills closing and relocation to China.
Emmett
emenot
To think China will not be an aggressor when they are capable is totally ignorance of China’s mentality after being in its bamboo curtain for decades and the stigma “sick men of asia” chip for centuries on their shoulder is stupid. How can these idiots Norman Angell, Naval War College professors Toshi Yoshihara, James Holmes and Lt. Cmdr. Matthew Harper qualified themselves to issue these opinion is way beyond me! Have they forgot how much China still hate Japan? Have they forgot so many in the upper military echelon still remember the Korean War. Imagin that…
Stiennon
Just a minor correction to an otherwise fascinating rebuttal. Canada is actually the US’ largest trading partner. Although yes, the US imports much more from China ($364 million vs $275 million in 2010) the total trade in both directions is still greater with Canada. http://dataweb.usitc.gov/scripts/cy_m3_run.asp
nirvana
@Stiennon,
These numbers are Billions, not millions.
Our world is governed by people who wants us to believe in crazyness:
-The world first economy has stopped producing consumer goods so that it can specialize in producing weapons, “services” and monkey money.
-The world second economy has been producing cheap consumer goods for citizens of the world first economy to waste. The world second economy has been buying monkey money to support its virtual value so that it can to buy … weapons.
-Together there are burning fossil energy more than any other economy. Together, they are spending more than any nation in defence budget.
-Both economies are scaring each other with “neutral” agencies’ credit ratings. I will not buy anymore your debts if you do not stop containing my military, says the Second. Stop challenging my military or I will make millions of your workers jobless, says the First.
Is that the definition of globalisation?
Meanwhile, the citizens of both heard about “human rights” vs “internal affairs”, “national interests” vs “core interests” and “international law” vs “sacred ancestor heritage”.
nirvana
The author, it seems, has forgetten to factor in another dimension of globalisation which is globalisation of responsible citizenship. With the “globally connected” citizens, states have found it much difficult to deceive their own citizens.
In 1963, when J.F. Kennedy contemplated the option of withdrawing from Vietnam, he was assassinated. His successor chose the opposite policy and unleashed the 2nd Indochina War. The “national interests” told to US citizens were to help an ally (South Vietnam) and to contain vicious communist China. Over 10 years, 60 thousands US young men died for the cause. Which country is the first US creditor today? How do you think the relatives of these young men feel today?
In 1979, after visiting the US, Deng Xiao Ping unleashed his Indochina War. The stated “national interests” were to help an ally (the Khmer Rouge) and to “touch the tiger’s tail”, i.e. to test the determination of China’s then No 1 enemy, the Soviet demon. Over 30 days, 20 thousands Chinese young men died for the cause. How do you think their relatives feel today? Where from does China relies on for its deadly weapons development today?
You may asked: how do Indochinese feel today? Somewhere on the Internet a Vietnamese blogger wrote that he was very scared of the next war with China…There is no doubt that so are his countrymen, and so are the Filipinos. Believe me, they all are scared as much as the French, the British and most of the Europeans were scared of the German Nazis. At least as much as the Chinese were of Imperialist Japan. And if you look-up history books on the two first Indochina Wars, you will find that the Vietnamese were also very afraid of the French in 1946, as well as of the US in 1956.
But you know what?
Like the French and the British, and most Europeans, these people did not cultivate a culture of hatred vis-à-vis their former enemies. This is how peace has lasted since, in Europe and in South East Asia. I believe that, although the situation is bleak, a future war in SEA can be avoided when citizens, not big corporates and “special interest groups”, challenge first their own state claims. When your state tells you that national interests are at stakes, take a step back, analyse the record of their behaviours… and blog extensively before preparing to die for the cause! When states invoke “ancestors” legacy, “traditional” enemies, be even more suspicious. And furthermore, look at the positive side of your adversary’s state when you critisize their dark side. This suggestion is mainly for Chinese and Americans but it applies to ASEAN citizens equally.
a_canadian_observer
@nirvana: Very well said! Hope the CCP-bloggers here communicate the message to their war mongers in china
.
Leonard R.
@Reason: @Leonard R
hey, can you write for my site? http://www.chimericawar.org
Thanks. I’m not sure what I’d write about. But I’ll visit the site.
**
@John Chan:
“Why can USA protect itself and China can’t….No matter how bizarre USA behaves; you always say USA is in the right, anything China does even to defend itself, you always say it is bad like “ethno-nationalist militarist state”.
**
No the US is not always right. And China is not always wrong. There is no shortage of bizarre, stupid behavior by the United States in this new century.
Unfortunately, China ‘protecting itself’ involves a direct threat to the United States. It’s really that simple. The US Navy has to sail and fly in the Far East to protect the United States. It is the nature of the world we live in.
The 19-dot line should be viewed by the United States as casus belli. But it’s only one in a long series of casus belli during the last fifteen years.
China has been waging war against the US on different levels, sometimes brilliantly, sometimes arrogantly and stupidly. The US has been pretending there is no conflict. I hope one of these days, someone in authority will decide it’s time to stop pretending.
Cyrus
Though that may be the cause, I have seen the United States gain so much Economically due to both World Wars.
emenot
Thats because Asia and Europe was flatten by these wars, thats also the reason why Europe and Asia have newer and sometimes better manufacturing facilities because they had to be build after the war, while USA factorys such as the steel industries as aging and crumpling. China had become the poster child of new emerging giant is because they build new factories from when they had nothing!
yang zi
War is still possible but more costly and less effective. it is not likely Taiwan will declare formal independence.
Strategist thinks of wars like play chess, but real war is complicated. American people may not have the stomach for a war with China, especially if China has a massive nuclear deterrence (the foolish CCP is dragging its feet on this, for fear of US suspicion?)
just think of this scenario: China has a WMD force equal to US’s, China is not making alliances against US, China is good for US business.
do you think a war is still possible? I say NO.
Leonard R.
The answer is “YES”, for the following reasons.
The USA has already existed in a MAD environment for six decades.
China has not. There are at least two differences with China.
1. Most importantly, the US is already at war with China. This is not a war
of proxies. It is multi-level warfare that involves China directly targeting US Carriers, launching hundreds of cyber-attacks against the US government, knocking military aircraft out of the sky and damaging US ships in the West Philippines (East) Sea. It involves testing EMP weapons near the US coast. And I haven’t even mentioned the financial markets.
AND
2. Whatever the flaws of the Soviet/Russian and American political structures,
their leaders were responsible adults. They were not spoiled little emperors with bad manners and an addiction to gambling.
Bottom line: Peace through MAD was possible with Russia. It is impossible with the PRC. Westerners are at last waking up to this truth.
ozivan
@Leonard R. Whenever you comment, I observed that you’re quite bent on wanting a military conflict or war of any sorts to happen between the US & China.
Why is it so ? Is there anything personal that had happened, possibly caused by a Chinese person, that has hurt and left you with so much bitterness against the Chinese nation and people ?
When you wrote : They were….spoiled little emperors with bad manners and an addiction to gambling.
There’s so much rancour in you.
If you have been hurt deeply by someone, somewhere in the Diplomat, I would like to appeal to you to consider this thought.
Two WRONGS doesn’t make a RIGHT.
Leonard R.
Personally, I have had nothing except good experiences with Chinese people.
I have been to the Mainland several times and the people there are among the nicest people in Asia.
A little side note, just this week, I was talking to a Chinese-American who complained to me about how he was treated in the PRC. He and I see the same China.
I’ve been around a little. I know a little about history. I’m not the only American who holds my views. IMO, our numbers our growing. And we have influence – not enough yet perhaps. But the PLA will win our case for us. I am very confident about that.
In one sense, the West is lucky China is not free. A free China could truly
dominate the world. The energy of the people, their numbers, their intelligence, their work ethic and their genius for organizing is truly something to marvel at.
What the West faces today is not like that. We face a warped ethno-nationalist militarist state with its boot on the neck of the people’s real potential. Personally, I don’t care what the PRC does to its own people. The problem is, governments like that can never stop at their own borders.
It’s not like we Westerners haven’t seen anything similar in the past. We have a long history too. The CCP isn’t nearly as scary as Nazi Germany. And it’s not nearly as stable as the Soviet Union. But I’m afraid lasting peace with the PRC is impossible. I pray I’m wrong. Unfortunately, everything I see tells me I’m right.
ozivan
@Leonard R. Phew..!! I am cheered, and thank you for the trouble to explain. From what you wrote, you’ve more than cleared yourself, that you’re not anti-China.
I suspect that a few more seemingly anti-China bloggers are not really anti-China like you, they just cannot stand some comments being made in the Diplomat.
For me, I have faith in China that it will, and has to, go democratic within 15 to 20 years, initially something along the lines of the Singaporean democracy model under Lee Kuan Yew. The reason (my own only I must say, rightly or wrongly) being that as China grows rich and modern, those who are currently age 40 and over now feels great nationalism in their hearts, while the teenagers (the little “Emperors”) couldn’t and often doesn’t bother to connect to this strong feeling.
The very young as they grow older, want more expression and freedoms, so we may see a future where China will be forced to cater to their needs by giving more freedoms in the next 15 to 20 years, but under a strong one party system. The only issue is whether, it will come by peaceful self evolution, or by external instigation or push. The former will be good, as it is the least chaotic.
The British colonialist had never permitted free elections to its colonies, but only gave GREAT MEASURES of freedoms, and it worked. Free elections came only after the colonies got independence. I am saying, in the early stages of China’s democracy, this road might be better so that the Chinese get adapted to the responsibilities that go with freedoms and human rights before achieving full democracy.
Will say more in the next comment.
Once again, thank you Leonard.
ozivan
@Leonard R. A thousand apologies to you. I wrote mistakenly this : I suspect that a few more seemingly anti-China bloggers are not really anti-China like you,
It should be : I suspect that a few more seemingly anti-China bloggers like you are not really anti-China,…
Hope you’ll forgive me.
Reason
@Leonard R
hey, can you write for my site? http://www.chimericawar.org
John Chan
@Leonard R:
Why does China build up military strength to defend itself and recover lost territory is an offence to the USA? While USA is thousands miles away from West Pacific ocean. Why did the USA want to blow up the world because USSR put some firecrackers on an island close to American shore? Why can USA protect itself and China can’t?
No matter how bizarre USA behaves; you always say USA is in the right, anything China does even to defend itself, you always say it is bad like “ethno-nationalist militarist state”. Why don’t you figure out similar demonizing terms to describe the predatory imperialist USA who is bombing and killing non-stop all over the world since WWII.
I have never seen such hypocrite like you, slandering and smearing China as worst as you can, and you white wash you insidious intent with an expression that you couldn’t help. Leonard R, you must work in sub-prime loan industry, Teflon David Sambol must be your tutor, who attacks relentless and convincingly, but when he was confronted with truth, he just let things roll off the back and never bother him.
emenot
@Leonard R:
You are really just seeing the surface of the Chinese Smiling Fox’s. You silly stinky White Barbarian Ghost”. Yes, if you are in business and as a tourist you may had experienced free winning and dinning including expensive lodging from your think gracious Chinese host, but thats the way they butter you up for slaughter. How I know this, I am Chinese!
Reason
@Yang zi
China does not have a “massive nuclear” deterrence … where on earth do you get this idea from? Even if China started to increase its capacity it would be dwarfed by the US and Russia at anytime in the future.
During the Cold War the US had over 35,000 nuclear war heads pointing at Russia … The USSR had less, probably around 30,000
China has somewhere between 100 -400. I’ll likely wager that it is somewhere between 100-200. Of which, even less are long-range that could hit the US. There’s some great open source info out there on what a state of disrepair the Chinese nuclear force was in during 70s/80s and 90s… with the crews living miserable lives and with almost no funding… it’s only in the last decade or so that the PLA has received proper funding for its nuclear forces and begun to modernize and connect them through the concept of informationization and give them the respect they deserve.
Why would you think that the US would be intimidated by China’s paltry few nuclear weapons..? Of which Missile Defense and Aegis could neutralize a considerable amount…. Something that wasn’t around in the Cold War.
I’ve noticed on many Chinese forums that Chinese netizens are very “free” to talk about nuclear exchange in a really flippant way… kinda like a school boy threatening to bring his daddy’s pistol to school if the other kids don’t stop criticizing him… Or maybe it is a mistaken notion that because China gives off the perception that it is ready to use its nuclear weapons this would intimidate the other opponent.
I am very much convinced that when the US thinks about strategically countering China, the nuclear question weighs very low on their thinking…. as it’s an absolute fact that any use of nuclear weapons by China against any of the US allies would bring down a cataclysmic response on China – A Nuclear option would be such ridiculous path for China to follow that US strategists rarely have to give it too much thought having spent the last 70 years dealing with Russia’s very REAL nuclear threat.
Right now the US has 5013 Nuclear missiles.. all of which could have the accuracy to knock off Hu Jin Tao’s toupee… where as China has a handful, with only a tiny fraction of them able to reach continental US.
There are many potential ‘unfair’ fights that exists between the US and China… Nuclear confrontation is China’s WORST OPTION…. it will never close the gap on the US, and the US would never be intimidated to act because China has nuclear weapons… this is a myth created on China forums.
Yang zi
My point exactly, China need to build a credible nuclear deterrent. I don’t think it’s that difficult to do. A good 10 year effort will do. A MAD blance will dissuade escalation, not a first use by China. remember, US is the only one that uses nuclear weapon. China will still use the doctrine of no first use, but with massive nuclear force and credible survivability. This is different from what china forums are saying.
Unfortunately, CCP’s strategist dosnt think as I do.
emenot
@yang zi:
Did you even know that Mao sent thousands of bare footed soldiers of the young and the very old into American’s machine gun line of fire to exhaust their ammo? You silly person. Do you think the Chinese right wingers would care who and how many will die for their grasp on power?
Leonard R.
Lt. Commander Matthew Harper needs to resign from the United States Navy
and go work for the CCP. And if he has Friedman as an ally, that’s two strikes against him. One more is all he needs for a trifecta & a strike-out.
As to the question of whether a ‘limited war’ is possible, it all depends on the limits of the word “limited”. (Sorry to paraphrase President Clinton.)
I hope to God that if China sinks a US Carrier it will result the total destruction of every large city on the Chinese mainland. If that’s not the case, why even bother to have a navy? Let’s dry-dock our subs and start kowtowing to the Central Committee.
yang zi
no idea where you get that confidence, that US can destroy every large city in China. unless WMD is used, I don’t think that’s possible. China just need to build up its own strategic force and destroy US big cities in retaliation. besides, destroying all the Chinese big cities will put you and US on the evil level. are you sure GOD is on your side?
Back to the article, If a civil war is possible among people living together, a war is possible in a globalized economy. nationalism is still alive and well.
however, I don’t think the stakes are high enough for US. China doesn’t want the whole world, it just want what is hers.
Rambo
And what is it that China wants?
Sinodefender
China wants others to stop claiming China’s lands as theirs… China would also like the U.S. to stop being a hypocrite complaining about China’s “crimes”.
a_canadian_observer
@Sinodefender: china owns nothing in the SCS. If it actually does, as a big country, it would have taken the case to the UN and resolved it with grace.
There is nothing wrong with pointing out crimes made by china.
emenot
@Sinodefender:
So how many millinium do you suggest China should go back on its claims of THEIR land?
emenot
@Sinodefender:
So should we all consister to be of African since our mutual ancestor are from Africa? The whole earth was colonized by African and is understood by science and history.
mareo2
The idea that economics alone can avoid a war is ridiculous. We humans beings are driven by emotions just as much as profit. No matter how rich they are, if they have money for guns and think that they are humiliated there is a real risk that sooner or later they are going to attack until their pride is satisfied. In special in a country were the CCP don’t trust to have full control of the PLA, because agencies and ministries are independent fiefdoms that often act without consult with the rest of the government.